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Chat Logs
Saturday, February 28, 2026
- dreamrealIt's the same thing.
- dreamrealHow do you CANCEL a person? What kind of return from that is possible?
- jreicherI think it's a way of disguising an ongoing ad hominem attack as something more acceptable.
- blueThe funny things is that Dems have been nearly forever saying "freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequence". That hit them HARD after Charlie Kirk.
- bluething*
- blue(In fact: freedom of speech actually DOES mean freedom from consequences... that's the point, but Dems are too thick to get it)
- dreamrealWell, it's funny what happens when you can't restrain your glee. But no, it doesn't quite mean freedom from consequence: it means you might have the freedom to say something and that something might actually serve as a lever.
- dreamrealBut you DO have the freedom to be a jerk... and be seen and treated like a jerk.
- blueI think Dems are absolute hyenas for mocking his death, but should they lose their jobs over it? not SPECIFICALLY; I mean, if I were their employer I'd honestly ask them if you feel glee at the death of another person, and if they do, I'd strongly consider terminating them on account of differing values
- dreamrealOr an evil person. It's not isolated to the dems, it's just that right now the GOP is ascendant so they're crying a lot more than usual.
- dreamrealblue: yeah, well. That's the dildo of consequences! It's hard to lube.
- blueThis isn't consequences per se: this is me discovering a side of you that I didn't know exist, and that I don't know if I want to interface with anymore
- blueregardless of that, I don't know who's stupid enough to glee over someone's death on SM with his real name
- blueI mean, you gotta understand that's gonna come back at you, SOMEHOW, SOMEWHEN
- dreamrealWell, plenty of examples desperate to make sure their friends know they're the GOOD ONES for celebrating the RIGHT MURDER
- dreamrealmidwits thinking murder's surely abstract, we see enough of it on TV
- blueand then you get your typical "this guy was for guns so it's cosmic justice". is THAT how we do things now?
- dreamrealwell, it's how they think
- dreamrealthat's the corrosiveness, everything's reduced to soundbites because they can't hold two things, especially contrasting things, in their heads at one time. Again, not a democratic problem, just a problem they seem eager to display because stupidity is an easy disability
- dreamrealsorry, democrats, I don't lie about what I think easily
- dreamrealI'd rather someone recoil in horror at something I say if it's a true representation
- dreamrealbecause if it's horrible and I think it, well, show me where I'm wrong
- dreamrealplease
- dreamrealtikkun olam is important to me, to provide as well as receive
- blueand next point is, "I didn't agree with the guy, but he didn't deserve to die"
- blueWHY do you need to disclaim THAT?
- bluenot wishing people die shouldn't be contingent upon agreement of views, you're creating an evil link
- dreamrealWell, not only that. But the funniest thing is that when you ask them what they actually disagreed with, it's someone else's summary of something he didn't quite say
- dreamreal"he said two paragraphs, the short version is 'guns yay'" when, uh, no
- blueyou making it sound like this: "if I only said I didn't deserve he died, then I agree with his views"
- blueah... no?
- blueyou're just saying you don't think people should be gunned down
- dreamrealHis defense of guns was pretty in-depth and he did in fact say some things that are unpleasant about tradeoffs
- bluehe didn't dserve*
- dreamrealblue: yeah
- dreamrealI mean, I think neither he nor anyone else should be murdered, although there are exceptions to the "I hope they don't die" statement
- bluethen point is, such a dislaimer is basically you talking about yourself: you're saying: I don't want to be associated with this guy... but I still don't wanna come across like a jerk. but congrats, you just did
- dreamrealI still can't celebrate bin laden's death, or sinwar's, but ... is the world really worse off since they found their way to sheol? uhh... no
- dreamrealblue: no doubt
- bluewell that's the thing, right
- dreamrealaight, good shabbos
- dreamrealSorry, it's ... well... shabbos
- bluegood shabbos! I need to sleep anyway
- blueya no worries
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New issue #128: Feature discovery endpoint for UI clients - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/issues/128
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New issue #127: Make OIDC optional via Spring profile - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/issues/127
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #129: Updating to make OIDC configuration a runtime profile - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/129
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #133: Bump hono from 4.11.9 to 4.12.3 in /frontend - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/133
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #132: Bump qs from 6.14.1 to 6.15.0 in /frontend - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/132
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #131: Bump minimatch in /frontend - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/131
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #130: Updating for prep for opening repo - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/130
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New issue #134: IRC adapter: auto-deop when opped - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/issues/134
- bluedreamreal: https://nevet.repopack.app/
- bluenow I gotta wire it up, let's see how well that works
- dreamrealwoot!
- dreamrealI'm going to work on a feature to expose whether OIDC is configured or not in a few minutes, fixing an IRC problem
- bluenice
- dreamreal(Working on 134 now, 128 is next)
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #135: Adding autodeop feature for IRC services - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/135
- dreamrealNOICE.
- bluedreamreal: this is exciting; I get redeployment times for the primate app of <10s. I still need to optimise the nevet Containerfile, but I think I can get it to redeploy quite fast, hopefully
- bluedreamreal: can we add a GET /version endpoint that is not auth'd?
- bluethat would be the fastest way for frontends to test connectivity
- dreamrealis there one that IS authed now?
- dreamreal(the answer is, of course, yes, but I need to understand scope)
- blueno. I don't think there's one at all
- dreamrealfile an issue - actually, the feature endpoint (for 128) might serve.
- bluethere's a /feature endpoint?
- blueoh, it's an open item
- dreamrealNot for the next ten minutes, at least!
- dreamrealI mean, I'm working on it AS WE TYPE right now
- dreamrealwill expose what services and operations are in the runtime, as well as OTP, OIDC settings (like "are they there," not "how are they configured")
- blueI don't really care about WHAT it does for NOW, only that I can access it unfettered
- blueand also, I need to figure out how to redeploy nevet itself
- bluethat being said, phaleth did an excellent job on this one, as always
- dreamrealI'm working on it, and not being gated is *definitely* a hard nonnegotiable requirement
- bluewdym with gated?
- dreamreal"no security requirements for /feature"
- dreamrealor /features i guess
- dreamreali.e., what you asked for!
- blueI asked for a simple GET route that I don't need anything for
- dreamrealyep
- dreamrealexactly
- dreamreal100%
- blueand that is a problem.. because?
- dreamrealit's not a problem
- blueoh, ok
- dreamrealIt's a hard requirement
- dreamrealas in, the feature does not work if that isn't met
- bluemy point was only, that this GET route would satisfy:
- blueAuth: None
- blueyou already have Auth: None routes. just no GET
- bluebut I think we're talking about the same thing, anyway
- bluelike 90% we're too smart for each other, this is a real problem
- blueanyway, back to how to redeploy nevet fast
- dreamrealI'm almost done with this
- dreamrealand this will be GET /features
- dreamrealIt's very useful because things like this expose some inconsistencies in the adapter implementations
- dreamrealmost of them are really minor: things that can be corrected with a few lines of code
- dreamrealand nearly all because of the rolling nature of the design
- dreamrealservice-blog is naturally the worst offender :D
- dreamrealrunning full tests now
- dreamrealrunning full tests now: curl http://localhost:8080/features yields:
- dreamreal`{"version":{"name":"nevet","version":"1.0","commit":"3fb508b","branch":"feature/128-feature-discovery-endpoint","buildTime":"2026-02-28T17:08:12Z"},"authentication":{"otp":true,"oidc":null},"operationGroups":["21-matches","ask","cal","calc","dictionary","factoid","github","hangman","hangman-admin","karma","poetry","rss","safecracker","sentiment","specs","tell","urltitle","version","weather"],"adapt
- dreamrealers":["console","discord","http","irc","mailto","slack"],"ai":true}`
- dreamrealthat actually does reflect the state of the instance that was run against
- dreamrealversion
- nevetnevet 1.0 | 90f413a (main) | Built 2026-02-28 12:15:36 EST
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #136: Adding /features endpoint - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/136
- blueMerge pull request #136 from jottinger/feature/128-feature-discovery-endpoint
- bluedreamreal: seems like I'm at the tip
- bluenow it's showtime
- blueoh lord
- blue => [builder 4/4] RUN --mount=type=cache,target=/root/.m2 ./mvnw clean package -DskipTests 63.3s
- bluestill going, let's hope that's cached next time
- blueok, 137.8s
- bluedefinitely room for improvement there, but for an initial build acceptable
- bluenow doing a rebuild
- dreamreal-DskipTests=true
- blueok, all cached, rebuilt in 4.3s
- bluenow let's try to redeploy
- blueFeb 28 18:34:17 nevet-be java[55]: 18:34:17.084 [main ] INFO com.enigmastation.streampack.NevetApplication - Started: nevet 1.0 | cc4bfa1 (master) | Built 2026-02-28 18:
- blue30:36 CET
- blueGOOD.
- bluenow let's try to wire the features -- just return whatever they return
- bluedreamreal: I present: https://nevet.repopack.app/features
- blue"commit":"cc4bfa1"
- dreamrealnoice!
- bluenot entirely sure which commit that is supposed to represent
- dreamrealversion
- nevetnevet 1.0 | 90f413a (main) | Built 2026-02-28 12:15:36 EST
- bluenote that I'm purely rebasing against your branch
- blueI'm not rewriting your history, so I think I should be seeing 90f413a as well...
- bluemaybe I messed up something
- blueare you sure the features endpoitn shows correct data?
- dreamrealif you're on a differen repo, though
- bluemy repo's history is the same as yours, just with a few commits on top
- bluehow are you getting the commit info?
- dreamrealif you have commits, that'd be it
- bluemy last commit is 5cef64e67be89cda0ebf16b270f35549176e5a6c though...
- bluemaybe it's some commit inbetween
- blueI'll rebuild nevet
- bluehm, now it's running the maven phase again, damn
- blueI did change it to -DskipTests=true
- bluenot sure how to cache it
- blueok, now it's 5cef64e, yippie
- bluethe maven build took 100s
- dreamrealwell, the *actual* way you should do it is run mvn outside of the container and just copy app.jar in
- dreamrealbut nooooo everyone's like "docker is the best, why not use docker to build, it'll be great"
- dreamrealbut yes, there're lots of modules to go through, it's a pain
- dreamrealand if I ever do native builds it'll be WORSE
- bluethat way is never gonna be properly deployable
- blueI'm gonna try -T 1C
- bluein-container build should be just as fast with nspawn
- * dreamreal nods
- bluedreamreal: -T 1C got it down to 66s
- blueI'm gonna build again, just to see if that's anywhere reliable or just a fluke
- blueI mean, the first build was 130s. the one with the m4 cache (no redownloading of mvn packages) was 100s. now we're at 66s. we're getting *somewhere*
- bluehm, this was fast, 4s. so probably everything cached
- blueI'll try pushing out a git commit
- blueyeah, a single commit, even if it's inside apps/primate, totally busts the mvn cache
- bluewhat a dumpster fire
- dreamrealWell, don't copy in the user stuff then!
- bluewhat user stuff?
- dreamrealcopy the pom.xml, app, service*, operation*, lib*
- blueI just do `COPY repo/. ./`
- blueai said it's a multimodule maven build and that I should copy everything
- blueand since I have no idea how this works, I listened to it
- bluewhat's it matter what I copy, anyway? shouldn't the builder just build what's necessary?
- dreamrealBecause of the way docker layers work
- dreamrealwhen you change a layer, the cache is invalidated
- dreamrealthe AI is right WRT maven, wrong because you're changing bits of it
- dreamrealso you copy in WHAT THE BUILD NEEDS and nothing more
- dreamrealthe maven parts are ./pom.xml, app, lib*, service*, operation*, I think
- dreamrealI've tried to follow a rough convention for them all
- blueheck, I'm not changing ANYTHING
- blueI pushed to apps/primate, which is no java code, at all
- blueand it still busted the cache
- dreamrealright, if you change the filesystem in the docker image, that's the cache broken
- dreamrealso you copy in WHAT THE CACHE NEEDS, nothing else
- dreamrealit is known
- bluesomehow the cache isn't broken for npm...
- dreamrealdunno what to tell you, man
- blueI think it's a maven issue, not a docker issue
- dreamrealthis is pretty standard for the OCI stuff
- bluethis is somewhat beyond me, but luckily, I don't need to redeploy nevet itself SO often
- dreamrealI'll have a change for you soon! factoid updates.
- bluedreamreal: https://nevet.repopack.app/otp/request
- nevetPrimate app
- blueunfortunately... mails don't get sent
- bluewhich is ANOTHER fire I need putting out
- dreamrealmail configuration is a drag, yes
- blueRP has an email service
- bluewhich I guess, I will use, I just need to figure out the credentials
- blueok, need host & port
- * blue goes on a search
- bluepretty sure phaleth had that configured for gitea...
- blueapp.ini
- blueew ew ew
- blueapp.ini--
- nevetapp.ini now has karma of -1.
- blueapp.ini--
- nevetapp.ini now has karma of -2.
- blueapp.ini--
- nevetapp.ini now has karma of -3.
- blueapp.ini--
- nevetapp.ini now has karma of -4.
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New PR #137: Adding factoid audit tracking - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/pull/137
- bluehmpf
- blueI can't see any MAIL daemon being configured
- dreamrealidea
- nevetIDEA is one of the "big two" Java IDEs, and probably the most popular of them. Has a free and commercial edition, and has capability to work for many, many, MANY languages. URL: https://jetbrains.com/idea Tag: ide
- dreamrealidea.stats
- nevetidea has been accessed 1 time, last accessed at 2026-02-28T18:18:11.940047Z.
- dreamrealidea
- nevetIDEA is one of the "big two" Java IDEs, and probably the most popular of them. Has a free and commercial edition, and has capability to work for many, many, MANY languages. URL: https://jetbrains.com/idea Tag: ide
- dreamrealidea.stats
- nevetidea has been accessed 2 times, last accessed at 2026-02-28T18:18:27.636040Z.
- dreamrealNoice.
- dreamrealOkay, that's it for today for me. Have a good one.
- blueI FOUND IT!
- bluehave a good one
- bot[jottinger/bytecode.news] New issue #138: Documentation lookup operation (!javadoc, !jsdoc, !pydoc) - https://github.com/jottinger/bytecode.news/issues/138
- bluedreamreal: will never respect SMPT_PASSWORD?
- bluenevet*
- blueas well as SMTP_SECURITY=force_tls
- blueI have all the credentials
- blueI just don't know if it's gonna respect them
- bluebbiab
- dreamrealblue: https://www.baeldung.com/spring-email
- dreamrealWe may need to expose more properties to the config
- bluewell tell me when you do because this blocks me a bit, I don't have a simple smtp mail
- blueI have a few improvements for primate that messing around with nevet has exposed, so I have enough to do for now
- bluebut I have this set-up for quick iteration now, so I can report back any blockers to you
- blueonce I got the primate app in a not-sorry state, I'll send you a PR
- bluelayla tov