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Tuesday, October 13, 2026 (America/New_York)
- jreicherI'm a bit surprised to hear you say your name with a soft `g' though. Wouldn't have thought that would be it.
- jreicherI'm sure I'm missing something obvious, because I haven't had time to learn about PUDL properly and I might have missed mention here, but why is there both a PUDL and non-PUDL version of BCN?
- dreamrealjreicher: https://pudl.bytecode.news/posts/2026/10/updates-for-bytecode-news
- dreamrealthere's also a nextjs UI and two basic UIs
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- bluedreamreal: good narration there
- blueone the thing I appreciate about this narration is that it's not a 1:1 rendition of the text; it's an understanding that the spoken word needs to carry a bit more familiarity and flair than a 'dry' written text
- blueone thing*
- blueany way, do more of these, you have a wonderful voice dreamreal!
- blueside note: I've been annoying Z (my wife) to no end, prononuced lever 'LEEver' (which is the accepted UK way); she's sure it's an absolute abomination, and I agree; but I also say `DEBri` instead of `debRI`, for debris, and that's a uk thing as well
- jreicherThe oral version elaborates on the written version. Wonder where that idea comes from...
- blueprobably by jreicher.
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- liolocblue: hey! is nub a package manager you made?
- liolocoh nvm found it, never heard of it
- bluelioloc: hi. no. but also, we're moving to flog, which *is* a package manager I'm making
- bluehttps://repopack.com/project/flog
- bluehttps://flog.run/
- nevetflog — predictable JavaScript package management
- bluethe installer won't work yet because repopack doesn't have release primitives yet, but primate 0.43 will move to flog
- blueand anyway repopack will have release primitives soon
- liolocwhat's the advantage of flog over nub? Seems like nub was kind of similar to your philosophy of not being bound by one specific library
- bluenub didn't work as expected, published prelease versions, using otp flows for publishing instead of a web flow, and was generally pretty broken...
- liolocah i see
- blueand flog adds things I've been missing in a package manager for nearly forever
- bluelike this https://flog.run/docs/release-sets
- bluesomehow package manager authors think it beneath them to include this feature :P
- bluebut this has caused me to publish broken versions in the past, more than once
- bluebecause the workspace protocol has no concept of versioning, that's the problem described there
- liolocah i see
- bluethe workspace protocol is a "trust-me-bro" situation. so flog checks for you that you're not publishing a package in a way that would break stuff
- blueanyway, 0.43 will be delayed a bit while we're moving to flog and finishing a few things flog needs in repopack for that, like releases
- bluelioloc: btw, repopack can do deploy task branches
- bluecan now*
- liolocso if you're testing a feature you can deploy it to a specific url?
- blueyes
- liolocthat's neat
- bluefor example, I can deploy your #151 point
- bluehttps://pewtxngij-task-151.repopack.app/
- nevetPrimate — The Universal Web Framework
- blueit will contain your changes to docs
- liolocthat's very cool
- bluehttps://pewtxngij-task-151.repopack.app/docs/backend/python#desktop-targets
- nevetPrimate — Python
- bluethis feature is currently limited to apps which do not use secrets or a fixture. but it will be extended to secrets/fixtures
- blueso in the future you'll be able to deploy a full app from a branch, seeded with fixtures and secrets
- liolocnice
- liolocwhat's an example of a fixture that would be added to the deployment?
- bluea database import
- liolocah yes neat, so you can use a test database for task branches
- liolocsomething like that?
- blueyes
- lioloccool
- bluefixtures are actually going to get their repo per project. so they'll be versioned
- blueand then when deploying a preview, you'll be able to provide a sha for the fixtures, or just get master
- liolocwait a second, i'm getting some interesting ideas
- lioloclike in the case of a cms, you could use a versioned fixture as your database no?
- blueyes
- liolocwow
- liolocand you'd be able to rollback to a specific sha
- lioloc?
- blueya of course. task apps are considered throwaways. but fixtures will be usable by normal apps as well, and you'll be able to deploy with any sha
- liolocwow
- liolocvery cool
- blueya
- bluereleases, packages and fixtures are a few of the remaining primitives missing from repopack to be able to cover most use cases
- blueand anyway I can already do with repopack now, what I couldn't do with fly before, and that is get a preview of my primate task branches
- liolocwhat about hosting costs ? are you using aws btw?
- blueusing my own vps
- blueon contabo
- bluecontabo has an api, so the network will grow mostly automatically, once I have installed the ability to do so
- liolocah kk
- bluecontabo will not back the only resource provider, could be I use aws in the future too, but reselling margins on aws are brutal
- bluewill not be the only*
- liolocis contabo better than hetzner?
- blueit's much easier to resell resources if you go lower, like vps or better dedis
- blueit's probably similar to hetzner, I never used hetzner but contabo has been very reliable
- bluerepopack is also going to offer an agentbox feature, which is getting a box for your `rp agent` and opencode/claude code/codex to run on
- blueconnected to the chat on repopack.com, of course
- blueit would be an alternative to having rp agent and the agent run on your computer
- bluebetter isolation, and your computer/server doesn't have to be on all the time
- liolochmm wouldn't it be better to let users use their own models with rp agent? I'm asking cause I'm wondering if agentboxes would strain your infrastructure
- blueya, rp agent is model agnostic. rp agent is just a bridge to connect your repopack.com chat to your agent
- blueyour agent controls what models you use
- liolocoh I see, but then what is an agentbox?
- bluea computer where rp agent runs on, alongside your opencode/claude code/codex
- liolocso its like a docker container for your agent?
- blueyes
- bluemore precisely, every task gets a docker container
- blueand is isolated from anything else
- blueit also gets the branch's checkout and instructions via an RP Tool
- bluewell, that's the theory, anyway
- liolocbut how does a person configure the agentbox? they would need to create a file or something? Like with docker containers?
- blueit's all done for you in the background, you buy the agentbox from repopack.com. or you buy your own vps independently and install rp agent and your agent on it
- blueyou can either. run it on your comp, on your vps, or via an agentbox from repopack.com
- liolocso you have 3 choices for rp agent, 1. buy from repopack.com, 2. buy vps and instsall rp agent on it 3. use your local computer?
- blueyes
- lioloci feel like most people would just use their own computer, unless you're an enterprise you wouldn't do it
- liolocwhich makes sense, since enterprises are better paying customers anyway
- bluethat's ok, the agentbox isn't the only source of income anyway, resellgin resources is
- blueagentbox is just going to be the least hassle. you add your codex api key to repopack.com and you're done
- liolocmaybe agentbox is not the best name, agentcontainer would be better imo
- blueya, too long though :P
- lioloccause everyone knows what a container is for coding purposes
- liolocyeah but the marketing spend you would have to do to tell people what a box is will be quite high
- bluecould be just `hosted agents` I think
- liolocyeah that's good too
- lioloceven better
- blueyup
- bluebbiab
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- dreamrealI need to do better music, too. That's very much a trial run
- dreamrealpodcast music needs to be flourish and not theme, and that's an actual song of mine
- dreamrealand my son said it sounded "very egyptian" :D
- blueyou need to do a podcast, with that radiophonic voice
- dreamrealoh my voice sucks, and my enunciation is awful
- blueI don't know, I like it. you also have a cool accent, slightly southern
- bluedreamreal: thoughts on the fixture subrepo?
- bluemy only concern is space, if it's used too much for binary stuff, then technically ostree is the superior solution, but I don't know
- bluethen again, db dumps are not binary. but db dumps aren't hte only type of fixture people use
- dreamrealcould use OCI images for it, they are naturally compressable
- blueyou want to use OCI images for *data*?
- blueso layered data?
- dreamrealI don't WANT anything, but if you're talking data, why not?
- blueI'm not against it, I just associatd OCI images with structure/build instructions, not data. but I guess why not
- bluethe important part though is that it's easily versionable, that's where git shines
- dreamrealeasily managed, easily versioned, easily compressed, easily MOUNTED, cohesive unit...
- dreamrealI dunno, maybe that's a dumb idea, I just woke up and I'm trying to come up with new music for the podcast intro, what do I know
- dreamrealjust sent you what I was thinking of
- dreamrealin discord
- bluehow is OCI easily versioned?
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- dreamrealOCI images are innately versioned, although I don't know what you're asking
- blueI'll think about it
- dreamrealblue: listen on discord, dang it!
- bluedreamreal: scrum week, sorry
- bluesoon
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- bluehi phaleth
- bluephaleth: flog can now fully build primate :)
- phalethhi blue
- phalethI failed to type backticks https://repopack.com/project/flog/tasks/40?
- phalethand I noticed, yeah
- bluecool
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- phalethanyway, surprising that flog works this well
- blueya, it's amaze sauce
- blueand we're just getting started
- blue"Clean Primate install improved from approximately 71s to 18s on this host, with byte-identical lockfiles."
- blue#40 soon done
- blue18s is still too long though
- phalethI've tried the trust me bro installer https://repopack.com/project/flog/tasks/42
- bluephaleth: yes, this is a known limitation
- bluethe flog project needs repopack release artifacts for that
- bluehttps://repopack.com/project/repopack/tasks/283
- bluethe last comment is by the flog agent
- blueand shows the way forward
- phalethwall of text
- phalethok, I will just put back the artifact url
- blueya
- blue#40 is solved
- phalethtwo jobs at once running
- blueya
- phalethit got a bit faster, nice
- phalethwould it be difficult to publish flog to npm?
- phalethI don't think the trust me bro script would work during image build
- blueprobably not
- blue(about publishing to npm)
- phalethok, then how to figure out the url to latest build? https://repopack.com/api/v0/jobs/1/runs/28/artifacts?project=flog
- phalethwithout knowing that the number 28 is latest
- bluechecking
- blueI'm afraid you'll have to wait for #283 to land for that
- blueI'll priortise it
- phalethok, no hurry
- bluelioloc: https://pewtxngij-task-213.repopack.app/blog/primate-043#native-desktop-launchers-and-sidecars
- nevetPrimate — Primate 0.43: diamond migrations, deferred navigation and direct SQL
- bluephaleth: I seriously hate how those task apps look. I'm going to make short_id electable
- bluemaybe `t-primate-213
- bluewhere primate is the short_id
- bluet-primate-213.repopack.app looks good; and is also a deterministic way to prevent people from using anything that starts with `t-` for normal apps
- phalethyeah, but at least they are not scrapeable
- phalethlike imagine somebody wanting to share the link publicly and then somebody else guessing the name of their project and trying out all task numbers
- blueyes, but almost all task apps will be private
- blueyou'll need to explicitly share them with a one-time link, or use --public (with special permissions)
- bluethe default mechanism won't be generally accessibl
- bluee
- phalethone-time link, but what if they wanna navigate the page or just accidentally close browser?
- phalethI think it's totally fine the way it is
- blueI think exposing task apps to -world- has all kinds of bad implications
- blueand those urls look like some chinese spam website
- blueanyway, task apps are almost exclusively for developers wanting to preview things
- phalethyeah, but the project maintainer can always create a named app where they can deploy whatever
- blueyes
- bluethat's exactly what I was going to say
- blueif you just want a system where you have some people preview features, then create a normal app for it
- bluethe task apps are just a way to preview a task without having to download and deploy it all locally, including setting up a db and whatever
- phalethok, that means you can somehow hide them behind login, but they are not on the same domain as repopack.com
- phalethand traefik just routes trafic straight to containers
- blueya, I think that can work
- blueanyway they are also shortlived phaleth
- bluethey currently expire after 24h, unless you redeploy
- blueI'm thinking of reducing that massively
- bluemaybe 8h
- bluemaybe less
- phalethcan I take this one? https://repopack.com/project/primate/tasks/214
- phalethok
- phalethI'll just do that before clanker takes it
- phalethyeah, I cannot take it
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- phalethwell, assign works
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- blueyes
- bluejuts selfassign
- bluephaleth: https://repopack.com/project/flog/tasks/43
- blueaccording to clanker:
- blue- Resolution: 13.33s → 4.50–5.11s
- blue- Full warm-cache install: ~18s → 11.06s
- blueand he's not done yet, this is incremental
- phalethok, I can revise 214 afterwards
- phalethit invented the word packuments
- bluewhat's that?
- phalethdunno, nobody reads the crap it comes up with
- bluelol
- phalethelectron-to-chromium@1.5.454 was published during review :)
- phalethit looked through those files just to find that, crazy
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- bluedreamreal: BCN intro is GOOD
- blueforgive my preposterous delay
- dreamrealheh
- bluedreamreal: another thing I thought about: you reading the article aloud is gonna shut down good all those trolls on HN that say the website is completely ai-generated
- dreamrealYeah, imagine someone actually writing decent diction
- dreamrealbut I'm not worried about the trolls
- dreamrealreading it aloud also shows some inversions of thought process, which may feed into the posts themselves
- dreamrealLike, as a writer I know I'm going to get there, but as a speaker, you close some gaps sooner than you might otherwise have
- bluemhm
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- bluedreamreal: jreicher: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L01w2jJJGek
- nevetYouTube: John Butler Trio - Media | Because Music
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